JeevesBond — Wed, 14 Jan 2004 13:30:20 +0000

fifeclub... take a look at: http://www.csszengarden.com make sure you look at the code!

That's what got me started with XHTML/CSS - the first time I looked at that site I nearly creamed my pants with excitment (overexaggeration for comic effect)

Suzanne — Wed, 14 Jan 2004 03:53:52 +0000

I'm just saying that:

body {}

is the same as

.body {}

And the first is a clearer way to do it.

DU-Squid — Wed, 14 Jan 2004 03:40:46 +0000

Suzanne wrote: Um, DUSquid, if you use your CSS, you don't need to put class=body in there at all, eh?

Sorry didn't know that you didn't have to define the body class when you use css.

Suzanne — Tue, 13 Jan 2004 23:25:01 +0000

Wow, I get to say it three times in one thread, whee! Check out the learning section at the Web Standards site linked earlier -- there are many wonderful, solid, helpful resources on moving to tableless layouts if you choose.

Table-based layouts are still possible and in some cases may be indicated as the better design decision, however many things can be done with divs that previously HAD to be done with tables. Happy learning!

fifeclub — Tue, 13 Jan 2004 23:19:49 +0000

Thanks everybody. I've put fixing up that site on hold since it's just for family, but I'm still interested in learning more and doing things better (or even right )

One sidebar question in particluar:

JeevesBond wrote: Also there is no need to use tables in designs anymore, tags are far better.

JeevesBond, not using tables in design wasn't even on my radar. How do I construct layouts without them, and how would I do it with tags? I know that could end up being a long, lengthy lesson but can you give me a brief few-sentence overview and/or a link for more information on this?

Thanks

m3rajk — Tue, 13 Jan 2004 18:12:01 +0000

i forget where i found the complete deprecation list, but w3c schools has a html/xhtml list which are identicle and they note what's deprecated (supported in html 4.0 and some in xhtml 1.0 transitional/loose, but not in xhtml 1.0 strict and above)

most style things have been moved. cell spacing is the only one that hasn't been that i can think of. right now.i know the center tag itself, and the u and b tags have been deprecated too

JeevesBond — Fri, 09 Jan 2004 12:09:59 +0000

It's good that you are trying to follow web standards, but it doesn't seem you have an understanding of why they have been created, and the change of thinking required to design an XHTML/CSS site...It's not just a matter of converting HTML 4, it's a way of life!

Please follow Suzanne's advice and read the recommendations!

One facet of this: XHTML/CSS is the separation of content from layout code, this has particular relevance to your site: What you have done - even if it validates - is meaningless. You have not properly seperated code and content using CSS. For example: bgcolor="#ffffff" in your tag is returning an error when validated. This should be defined through CSS. Also there is no need to use tables in designs anymore, tags are far better.

Well I hope this makes sense, and helps a little

Suzanne — Fri, 09 Jan 2004 04:59:08 +0000

Um, DUSquid, if you use your CSS, you don't need to put class=body in there at all, eh?

DU-Squid — Fri, 09 Jan 2004 01:41:18 +0000

For the body just put this in the css part

body {
background-color: #FFFFFF;
color: #000000;
}

and then just make it

Busy — Tue, 06 Jan 2004 22:03:01 +0000

It's good you striving for XHTML standards and all, but think you should work to XHTML Trasnititional to start with, strict isn't the best thing to jump into if you haven't used a lot of CSS or done much strict handcoding.

Using Trans will allow you to get away with a lot more while still being tight on tidy coding, ie all tags must be closed, all lower case, all values quoted etc. another example is you can still use 99% of HTML tags or use CSS, or mix em up a bit, a far better way to learn while you code this way, allowing you to progress with the times as you learn whats needed - CSS

Using Strict you can't use a lot of 'normal' HTML, certain things aren't valid no matter what/how you do them and using a strict doc type without being strict code can/does cause problems in bigger pages/sites.

Good on ya for doing it, you'll have your ups and down but always go forward.