Jaiem — Wed, 26 Jan 2000 14:40:00 +0000

Justin - I assume you're refering to examples of why you might need a lawyer. Here are a few I can come up with off the top of my head:

1) Suppose Joe hosts with you. Someone sends you an email claiming Joe spammed them. What do you do? Do you take the person's word for it? Or, Do you tell the person "That's between you and Joe"? If you take action, Do you drop Joe on the spot? Or, Do you let Joe tell his side? What if you drop Joe just on the accusation and Joe wants to sue you for putting him out of business?

2) Suppose Joe hosts with you and he runs a forum on his site. Someone emails you and claims something on Joe's forum is slanderous/libelous to them. What do you do? If the person files a suit against Joe I'd bet a weeks pay you get named in the suit also since you're the hosting provider.

3) Suppose Joe runs a commercial site hosted with you. Someone emails you and claims Joe frauded them somehow. If they sue for fraud wanna bet you'll be named too?!

My point is that cyberspace is different from traditional store-front space. With traditional store-front space the land lord (the person renting you the store front) doesn't get involved in the affairs of his/her tenants as long as they pay the rent and don't destory the place. Anyone having an issue or problem with the tenant and trying to talk to the land lord about it would probably get the brush off. I doubt very much if someone sued a store-front business they would name the land lord as well.

But not in cyberspace. Right or wrong, appropriate or not, the hosting company (the cyberspace "land lord") does often get involved in issues of their clients (and not just their resllers and affiliates). It seems to me that as such the hosting company shares some liability with their clients. (not a lawyer, not a legal opinion)

I'm not saying it happens all the time but it could happen, espeically if e-commerce grows as much as futurists claim it will.

(and I'm not trying to start a debate in this thread about these topics, just somethings that have occurred to me when thinking about being a host/agent/reseller)

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[This message has been edited by Jaiem (edited 26 January 2000).]

Justin S — Tue, 25 Jan 2000 21:16:00 +0000

Jaiem: that sounds correct.

Ok- I get the point that I need a lawyer, but what have you actually seen? Anything? Nothing? Something? Give me some examples please...

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Justin S.

Jaiem — Tue, 25 Jan 2000 21:08:00 +0000

Adam - I hear you.

Have you considered being an agent instead? Some hosting companies like VenerNet use sales agents instead of resellers (you can resell too if you want).

As I understand the process, you're like a broker for the hosting company. You market, answer questions, provide any other services you may want, etc. But the customer only signs up with the host through you and you get a commission. All tech support, billing etc. goes directly through the hosting company.

Curtis - Did I get it right?

------------------
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Adam Lysne — Tue, 25 Jan 2000 18:31:00 +0000

Jaiem:

I was planning to start my own hosting company. Then I realized the costs. It can cost upwards of $500+ or more. Also, I found it to be a pain, when I did host a couple of sites, due to tech support related issues. Also, it can become time consuming, and the profits are small, unless you have a large number of customers. If you can start it out correctly, and do it right, that's good. If you have the money, and can afford to loose it, if the company or business does not work out. Either way, I say you need to think of what you are going to do, and if you can accomplish it. There are many more things involved rather than just getting a reseller account, and a website. You need legal stuff, and a lawyer (recommended), also many other hassles. I find it busy for me right now, considering I do not have the time. Maybe in the future, I will do it "right". For now, it can be very time consuming.

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Adam Lysne
FibrOptikL@aol.com
AOL- FibrOptikL
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ICQ- 49384845

[This message has been edited by Adam Lysne (edited 25 January 2000).]

Jaiem — Tue, 25 Jan 2000 14:35:00 +0000

Adam - In what ways is it a "pain"?

I've thought about being a reseller and just wondering what the "dark side" is.

Thanks.

------------------
ArtsNFlies.com
"It's not really a flyfishing shop, more like a Martha Stewart goes fishing thing!"

Original art, hand tied flies, unique books and gifts, free sweepstakes and MORE!
Come see what everyone is talking about!

[This message has been edited by Jaiem (edited 25 January 2000).]

fairhousing — Tue, 25 Jan 2000 08:47:00 +0000

no one needs a lawyer, but everybody should have at least one. it does matter what a lawyer draws up for u. u can and probably will still get sued at some time or another. the question is will they win. that's were ur attorney's skill comes in, both in drafting legal documents and the court room.

good luck

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[This message has been edited by fairhousing (edited 25 January 2000).]

Adam Lysne — Tue, 25 Jan 2000 05:42:00 +0000

I find hosting a pain, especially if your a reseller...that's just me.

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Adam Lysne
FibrOptikL@aol.com
AOL- FibrOptikL
AIM- f i b r Md
ICQ- 49384845

Justin S — Tue, 25 Jan 2000 00:23:00 +0000

Thanks everyone! You have sucessfuly scared me out of the hosting business Haha...

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Justin S.

orlando_5 — Tue, 25 Jan 2000 00:16:00 +0000

Jaiem:

So what you're saying is that if I drive a car that exploded because of a defected fuel tank, I shouldn't be able to sue the car company?

The only way to protect the little people is lawsuits. Lawsuites has made car a lot more safer. It prevent companies from cutting cornors.

Look at CIHost and Truehosting. Both hosting company screw their customers. CIHost was down for over three weeks. A lot of E commerce website lost customers when CIHost was/is down. IMHO, it is good to see some lawsuites against hosting companies that has been ripping off customers for the past years.

What the internet need more then ever is the self-righteous watch-dog groups. The more the better.

Jaiem — Mon, 24 Jan 2000 14:34:00 +0000

Justin - You can set up any policy you'd like and still get sued! A policy is just a defense, not a shield. These days anyone can sue for anything anytime. And even if you aren't sued there are dozens of self-appointed, self-righteous watch-dog groups who would just love to record you as having violated (in their opinion) some code of conduct or ethic.

A brief lesson in life:

(I don't mean to sound like I'm preaching but I know there are many young people here who might not have fully realized these things yet)

The business world is not a friendly place. It's not the "we're all in it together" world your teachers usually try to portray in business/economics class. It doesn't matter if you're selling hosting services, web design, used tires or oatmeal. When money is involved people will say and do things they would never otherwise do or care about. IOW, someone somewhere isn't going to like that you're in business and may try to put you out of business by any number of ways, legal or illegal, open or deceitful. It may be a competitor (especially a competitor!). It may be someone who wishes they had thought of it first. It maybe someone who doesn't like people named "Joe" or "Mary" or people that live in your town - whatever. Just be ready for anything no matter how dumb.

(sorry for the preaching)

------------------
ArtsNFlies.com
"It's not really a flyfishing shop, more like a Martha Stewart goes fishing thing!"

Original art, hand tied flies, unique books and gifts, free sweepstakes and MORE!
Come see what everyone is talking about!