anti — Fri, 23 Jul 1999 01:40:00 +0000

Hi Jodys,

I assume your hardware is setup !!?
I also assume that with your ADSL you got a box that has an ethernet-connector (at least that's the way I've seen it so far).

Next thing. Yes, RedHat is newbie-friendly.
But you have to consider that security is more important than newbie-friendlieness with a dedicated uplink.

I would go for Debian.
After partitioning you Harddisk (there are many good guides out), just do a base-install of debian and use the Internet Host preselection.

The installation will ask you for a few things ... and if you can't answer them ... hmmm ... maybe you should buy some webspace ... or ask a local Debian/Linux-Expert.

Some month ago I started writting a small guide how to do exactly this, but I never got over the "hardware selection and sizing"-chapter and it's on my home-system (which seems to have gone done last Saturday).
Sorry.

Just check the various linux sites and you'll surely find a good howto.

ciao
Anti

jodys — Fri, 23 Jul 1999 00:28:00 +0000

hello, Anti

could you provide me with some more information on setting up a linux server... I have redhat 6...
and will be connected with asdl.

you help would be great

regards

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e n d u r a d e z i n e
endura.co.nz

HostIndex — Wed, 21 Jul 1999 04:33:00 +0000

A well-founded hosting company is difficult to establish and may take several million dollars for large facilities, bandwidth, support staff, and so on. The better option would be to look at becoming a reseller of anm existing web hosting company or alternatively enrolling in a private-label program offered by some of the larger web hosts.

We have some information posted on our website about this subject, www.hostindex.com
Feel free to take a look.

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http://www.hostindex.com
Need a web host? Search the web's LARGEST hosting directory!

anti — Tue, 20 Jul 1999 00:50:00 +0000

Hi,

yes, jodys.

At my company I set up a small (Debian-)GNU/Linux-Box with Apache.

It's an AMD5x86-133 (~P75) with 48MB-Ram and two HD's (1GB+8GB).
It run's apache+mysql and ProFTP (much more secure than WuFTP).

It's main task is to be a local Debian-Mirror, but there are quite a few (private+project) HomePages on it.

... just took a look on the stats ...
Last month it serverd over 12 GB of Data.
There were about 800MB uploaded (that doesn't include the Debian-Mirroring).
We had 1.5 Million Database-accesses. (Don't ask me what, I don't write that software).

The highest load was 0.7 (That was when some departement-servers replicated the Databases).

The System _never_ swapped ... hmm ...

If you had a dedicated ISDN-line (64K) that server could easyly handle it.

btw: sometimes I run render-jobs on that system. that's the only time the system is fully used

ciao
Anti
btw:
a leased ISDN-Line "just" costs you 10000DM(Setup)+300DM(per Month)+200DM(1GB-Traffic).

jodys — Sun, 18 Jul 1999 22:34:00 +0000

and what about LINUX with APACHE web server? that software is all free

Brian Farkas — Mon, 28 Jun 1999 19:48:00 +0000

Yep, I'll vouch for you Shane. And I do agree with you on most points also. If you have people who are dedicated and have good skills, you can start up a host for a minimum amount of money. Of course, it is much better to have more money to buy top-of-the-line equipment, pay for advertising, etc. But I'm sure it could be done with enough devotion and effort.

Brian

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InfoStar: Web Design - Hosting - Programming
http://www.infostardesign.com

shaneh — Mon, 28 Jun 1999 16:50:00 +0000

Jason, I agree with you. This is a business. Like any other business it should be entered into with serious regard, and should be treated professionally. The reason I'm putting up such an argument is this: I used to work for HyperMart. I know the co founders personally. (Brain Farkas can vouch for that, by the way)

HyperMart was started out of a dorm room at Georgia Tech. With a VERY small cash contribution. That was on October 7, 1997. Ten months later, on August 1, Go2net, Inc. bought HyperMart for $6,000,000.

Could you sell your host for six million?

It depends more on a persons will, and vision, and commitment then the amount of startup capital.

Hosting is a business, and yes, it should be treated as such, but all businesses don't have to cost thousands of dollars to start up. And HyperMart isn't the only example of a company that had limited capital. Someone could start a great host right now for under $10,000 with the right people and talent. I guarantee it.

Shane.

Jason Ellis — Mon, 28 Jun 1999 03:07:00 +0000

In response to Shane's post, I would just like to point out that leasing a server from an ISP to run your hosting company is, in general, a bad idea. Why? Well, what happens if you decide you're not happy with that company's services any longer, or maybe you find a better deal somewhere else, and you decide you want to move to a new NOC?

When that happens, you then have to find another server (either buy or lease at that point, too), transfer all your accounts from one to the other, and then close out your account there. That may not sound too difficult, but it is. You should assume at least 15 minutes per account to move it from one server to another. Meanwhile you're paying for the bandwidth used, you're paying for both the old rental and the new rental, and you're paying the labor for someone to move all of those accounts.

Whereas if you'd owned your own server, you could have unplugged it and moved the thing. Yes, you'd have had some downtime, but if you planned it right it'd only be a couple hours or so and of course you'd do the move in the middle of the night.

The other reason I'd never rent a server from a hosting company is that you're really never sure what you really have. As I noted in my post above, no web server should ever run off of consumer-grade parts. But at $650 a month including bandwidth, I really doubt any company would put expensive parts into their servers.

Let me tell you about our first (and only) dedicated server experience. I won't tell you what company we were leasing from, but we leased what at that time was a state-of-the-art system - an Intel Pentium 266 box. I don't recall the exact specs anymore, but we specifically chose the Pentium 266.

Well, a couple months later my SysAdmin discovered that the server only had a P233 chip in it. When I called the company we were leasing from, the Vice President of Sales told me "no, you didn't buy a Pentium 266 server. You leased our Pentium 266 server package, which includes a Pentium 233 processor."

Needless to say, as soon as our 3 month contract was up we were out of there - we bought our own server and transfered all of our accounts over. And we haven't looked back.

I would never again lease a dedicated server to run our company. It may save you a lot of money short-term, but it'll cost you a lot more in the long run. Remember that when you don't own the server, you also don't own the software. So if a dedicated server you have today includes Cold Fusion installed by the ISP, and you move to your own server later, you're going to have to buy Cold Fusion or else you'll lose all the clients who had been using CF on your dedicated machine.

It's always a much better choice to own your server and software.

Jason

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Windows NT web hosting specialists.

Jason Ellis — Mon, 28 Jun 1999 01:09:00 +0000

Shane-

Your comparing leasing a server to leasing an office really isn't a good comparison. Leasing an office is a lot like colocating a server, something I highly recommend anyone do. Leasing a server is more like leasing your office completely furnished where your landlord owns the office, the desks, the computers, the telephones, the telephone numbers, the copy machine, the fax machine, etc. If you need to move your office, you walk out the door with whatever files you put in your landlord's filing cabinet and not much else. That's what leasing a dedicated server is best compared to. Not a great scenario, huh?

I stand by my original post. Remember, I've been running a hosting company for 16 months. And I admit I didn't have $50,000 to start. I started with about $20,000. And then I had to get another $10,000 load 6 months later. And to be honest with you, it's been 16 months and I still, personally, make less money than if I were working in the local McDonalds. I have a 15-year-old kid working in my office here answering phones and doing filing that makes more than I do on a per-hour basis (when you take what I pay myself and divide it out over the 70 hours a week I work).

Can you start a web hosting company for less than $50,000? Sure. Can you turn that company into a major success story? Absolutely. But I wouldn't recommend it.

Just to put it into a little perspective, after 16 months, my payroll (what Hosting Solutions pays it's staff, including myself) is well over $10,000 per month.

This is *not* a cheap industry. It costs a lot of money to run a hosting company. You say that running a hosting company isn't anything like running a restaurant. Well, you're right, partly. They're two totally different industries. But a hosting company is a business, and it has to be run like a business. There are far too many hosting companies out there that are run as people's hobbies, from basements or spare bedrooms, in whatever free time the owner has to do it in. And it is, 99% of the time, those hobby companies that end up developing a bad reputation and in the end hurt the reputation of the entire hosting industry.

This is a business. Treat it as such.

Jason

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Hosting Solutions, Inc. - www.hostingsolutions.net
Windows NT web hosting specialists.

shaneh — Sun, 27 Jun 1999 20:31:00 +0000

It doesn't have to be as difficult as Jason made it out to be.

You can cut the cost of Hardware, Software and connection by purchasing a dedicated server through a webhosting company. In my search, e-access.net looked like a winner. They provide you with a PentiumII 450 with 256mb Ram, NT, IIS, Mail, FTP, statistics software, and DNS software for around $650 a month. (in addition to a $125 start up fee)

You'll have to program a back end to handle signup processes, and provide members with easy to use utilities. If you have to hire someone the cost can rise, but not beyond a few thousand dollars.

True, you will want to offer your members support for various technologies, so install PERL, PHP, FP Extensions, and allow ASP to be used. All of those are free.

E-access will assist you in setting up the server, and if you run into any problems that will require a systems administrator, you can have someone there take care of it, at a rate of $50.00/hr. Much cheaper then staffing your own.

In most cases you will not need an office to start out. You can run it from your home, at substantially reduced costs.

True, this setup may not make for a world class hosting service, but it will get you off your feet at a price much lower then $50,000. And, if you play your cards well and balance low-cost and high quality and, above all, you offer consistant, capable and courteous customer service, you've got a good chance at sucess.

Shane Harter
shaneh@virtualite.com